Protandim

[Wotan]

Yes - the people that are saying its only a mixture of already-available antioxidant ingredients are missing the point somewhat.

It is firstly synergistic. The sum of the ingredients have a greater effect than the sum of the effects of the ingredients when taken singly. This is by no means unusual in biological systems.

Secondly, some (if not all) of the ingredients have effects that go beyond their simple anti-oxidation ones. To use an analogous example, many people take a magnesium supplement. It is very good at helping promote good bone growth. It is also, however, involved in 300 other metabolic processes. Citing just one of them, therefore, is inaccurate and misleading.

Thirdly, the effect is not one of additional exogenous antioxidation at all. It is one whereby production of the three major endogenous anti-oxidants of the body are all ramped up. This is bound to be more effective than simple supplementation.

[MJ.23]

The creators of this supplement are making an absolute killing off of this! The price they are charging is beyond extortionate!

Each tablet costs just over £1.00! A 1 month supply is £31 for 30 tabs. I am intrigued by this supplement as it has a lot of good press with a decent amount of research to back it up. I will be waiting until they move production into the UK; hopefully driving down costs. Problem is, if they can sell it for £31 now to a decent sized consumer base; will they need to lower it? I hope the prices are so high due to the import process.

[MiniHulk]

I think the curcumin is the major player in that mix and it probably as beneficial without all that other stuff, I recommend taking it for any inflammatory problems, including DOMS.

Although, it needs to be consumed with piperine, or either just have some black pepper around the same time to increase uptake. I make a tea with turmeric and black pepper, unfortunately you don't get much curcumin from it that way, but I can't afford the supps yet. Better than nothing this way...

As for ashwagandha, I got nothing from 2 months on it that was noticeable - I much prefer Rhodiola as an adaptagen.

[Wotan]

Quote

The creators of this supplement are making an absolute killing off of this! The price they are charging is beyond extortionate!

Each tablet costs just over £1.00! A 1 month supply is £31 for 30 tabs. I am intrigued by this supplement as it has a lot of good press with a decent amount of research to back it up. I will be waiting until they move production into the UK; hopefully driving down costs. Problem is, if they can sell it for £31 now to a decent sized consumer base; will they need to lower it? I hope the prices are so high due to the import process.

Apart from the profit motive plus the production, shipping and advertizing costs there is also the 40-odd years of research to pay for.

The price will probably not drop until the three patents associated with it cease to afford protection. This is still a few years off. After that it will be an open market and the cost will drop. On the other hand you can bet your bottom dollar that the market will also be flooded with bogus products and sub-standard formulations.

A pound a day - yup.

On the other hand the way I look at is:-

a) Its probably the cheapest insurance around. Think of the time and money you lose by being ill. Never mind the cost of prescriptions meds.
b) Its a pre-emptive painkiller. Who wants arthritis etc - who needs the actual, physical pain? If it stops my future need for Nurofen then its helping pay for itself now.
c) If you don't need as many supps then, again, its helping pay for itself now.
d) Who wants to be an old fart anyway - with a trouser belt up by his tits and slippers?
e) I might still get to cop off with that young bit of fluff down at the Co-op. No chance if I look like Albert Steptoe; much more chance if I still look like a cross between Cary Grant and Conan the Barbarian.
f) If I do then its cheaper than Viagra.
g) If I don't at least I can still keep up with the dog when taking it out for a walk.
h) If I live ten years longer (with or without either the dog or Viagra) then it would still be paying for itself through my extra pension payments.
i) I will then have the satisfaction of sticking two fingers up at the Chancellor and all the free-loaders in this country who will then have to work to continue paying my pension.
j) And I will have more time to write snotty letters to the Daily Mail about whatever little peeve I woke up with that day.
k) I will live long enough to see Jeremy Kyle and Oprah Winfrey snuff it. And so won't have to listen to their crap on the box anymore.
l) I might see Halley's Comet, England win the World Cup again and win the lottery (though there's more chance of that than England winning any damn cup, never mind the World one).
m) I might live long enough to get to holiday on Mars, drive a Buck Rogers type car personal transport module and buy a "beam me up Scotty" type gizmo to save walking down down to the Post Office.
n) On the other hand if it goes wrong and we all go bankrupt at least it will make living in a cardboard box more bearable.

Just some random thoughts. Have they made you feel better about it all?

[MiniHulk]

Lmao.

[daffy]

Wotan,

Are you, or have you tried, this supplement? If so, did you see any results?

[Wotan]

No, I tried to import it direct from the labs but they were unable/unwilling to export it. However they have now set up a license agreement with various individuals in various countries including the UK, so we can buy it from them. Pesonally I'd love to see MP buy shed loads and sell it on a rock-bottom prices!! Until then though I'm happy enough to buy it from the UK-licensed vendor.

Failing to import this stuff meant I went down two other paths, the salient one, here, involved altering vitamin C to make it much more effective (between five and ten times more so than the standard dissolved acid).

Just in case anyone still hasn't got the idea, Protandim is not an antioxidant as such. Yes it is, and yes it works that way. What it really does though is to switch the genes that mass-produce your own natural antioxidants on. So instead of just getting a trickle through a standard half-inch tap you end up getting hosed down with them.

I rather fancy that just taking a mixture of the ingredients will not work anywhere nearly as well, if at all. I realised this after my "experiments" with vitamin C. The secret is actually in the production I think, not the simple formula. If it works anywhere near as well as "hyper-absorbable" vitamin C then trust me I'll be buying it!

PS Some further info. The main endogenous antioxidant to be pushed into super-production are the SODs, apparantly. The main wiki entry for this class of substances can be found here:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superoxide_dismutase

You will notice that one of the guys that discovered them is - hey presto - one Mr J McCord, otherwise also known as the inventor of Protandim.

[MJ.23]

Quote

Apart from the profit motive plus the production, shipping and advertizing costs there is also the 40-odd years of research to pay for.

The price will probably not drop until the three patents associated with it cease to afford protection. This is still a few years off. After that it will be an open market and the cost will drop. On the other hand you can bet your bottom dollar that the market will also be flooded with bogus products and sub-standard formulations.

A pound a day - yup.

On the other hand the way I look at is:-

a) Its probably the cheapest insurance around. Think of the time and money you lose by being ill. Never mind the cost of prescriptions meds.
b) Its a pre-emptive painkiller. Who wants arthritis etc - who needs the actual, physical pain? If it stops my future need for Nurofen then its helping pay for itself now.
c) If you don't need as many supps then, again, its helping pay for itself now.
d) Who wants to be an old fart anyway - with a trouser belt up by his tits and slippers?
e) I might still get to cop off with that young bit of fluff down at the Co-op. No chance if I look like Albert Steptoe; much more chance if I still look like a cross between Cary Grant and Conan the Barbarian.
f) If I do then its cheaper than Viagra.
g) If I don't at least I can still keep up with the dog when taking it out for a walk.
h) If I live ten years longer (with or without either the dog or Viagra) then it would still be paying for itself through my extra pension payments.
i) I will then have the satisfaction of sticking two fingers up at the Chancellor and all the free-loaders in this country who will then have to work to continue paying my pension.
j) And I will have more time to write snotty letters to the Daily Mail about whatever little peeve I woke up with that day.
k) I will live long enough to see Jeremy Kyle and Oprah Winfrey snuff it. And so won't have to listen to their crap on the box anymore.
l) I might see Halley's Comet, England win the World Cup again and win the lottery (though there's more chance of that than England winning any damn cup, never mind the World one).
m) I might live long enough to get to holiday on Mars, drive a Buck Rogers type car personal transport module and buy a "beam me up Scotty" type gizmo to save walking down down to the Post Office.
n) On the other hand if it goes wrong and we all go bankrupt at least it will make living in a cardboard box more bearable.

Just some random thoughts. Have they made you feel better about it all?

Hold on tiger! You haven't tried it yet!