Post-workout cortisol

[MiniHulk]

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Except that the guy is twenty and doesn't need it.

@timmm Don't worry about cortisol at your age. More than anything else make sure you are getting enough sleep. If you are still worried about cortisol then simply take some extra vitamin C.

I thought that it was beneficial enough to take at any age, even if it wasn't predominantly for HGH... it certainly helps fight colds with me.

n.b. I didn't know his age, should've looked it up.

[MiniHulk]

I certainly wouldn't say that buying glutamine and vitamin c is a waste of money though...

[Timmm]

No I wouldnt say that buying glutamine and vitamin c are a waste of money, I was meaning that the phosphotidylserine is eye wateringly expensive.
I was aware that vitamin c had cortisol lowering effects, however a lot of the studies had mixed findings, and few of them had been done in humans (mostly fish). Also, the body produces antioxidants to buffer free radicals produced during intense exercise, and I was of the belief that supplementing with exogenous antioxidants caused the body to stop producing it's own.

Although I think glutamine is useful under certain circumstances (healing the gut, healing people with extensive tissue damage) I do not know that it has a place in everyday supplementation. A lot of the studies done with glutamine were using burns patients for example.
Secondly, the main recommendation I have heard is from Charles Poliquin who uses it for athletes that have hit a weight gaining plateau or are unable to gain weight. he uses a dose of 10g every hour or so to give a total dose of 10x10g through the day for one week.
Martin Berkhan has labelled it useless, and so i'm not sure that it's all that necessary, espeically is using BCAAs pre/post workout.

[Wotan]

Assuming you are in good overall health, and of normal constitution, let me tell you that at the age of twenty you have hormones coming out of your ears! Apart from wasting time, effort and money on supplements that exert an unnecessary hormonal influence it is perfectly possible to stuff yourself right up by taking the wrong ones.

You have obviously read around on the subject and that's a good thing (very good actually - it shows an intelligent approach that will save you half a ton of frustation and money over the next few years). Just a few very small pointers, though.

Vitamin C and cortisol - yes, the studies had mixed findings and yes they were sometimes carried out on fish. The biggest thing however is that stress can be physical, mental, chronic or acute - or a mixture of all four. Vitamin C does not combat mental stress (if I recall correctly at half past eleven at night having been up since six). It does however have "mood enhancing" properties that sometimes gets mistaken for stress reduction. Now you understand the source of the confusion!

Exogenous anti-oxidants will, to some degree, damp down production of the bodies own anti-oxidants. But the effect is short lived and since these external anti-oxidants tend to circulate within the blood and lymph fluids only there will always be a demand within the cells themselves and the structures within the cells that exogenous anti-oxidants cannot fill. Don't worry about them too much. You've probably got loads of your own in reserve anyway.

Glutamine is the most abundant a/a in the body. Its used extensively in wound healing and although the body makes it itself it cannot always fulfill demand - so it gets labelled "conditional". At your age and in good health and with a non-faddy diet there is very little that taking extra will do for you. My age? Different story! MH's health problem? Different story!

Do you see a pattern emerging here? Yes, things are more complicated than a lot of people give credit for!

If you want to gain a subtle edge in your quest for a Conan-like conquest of the known world let me give you a tip. I've already told you what it is - sleep! Seriously!! Its the cheapest, most necessary, easiest to obtain and most effective therapeutic agent known to man. Don't believe me? Go without sleep for two nights and tell me what you feel like on the third day. If you are still able to speak coherently that is!

It follows then that if you can find the discipline to go to bed at a reasonable hour (11.30 pm say) and actually go to sleep instead of reading, writing, watching a video or bashing away at a playstation thing then you will have gained after a few months a very noticable advantage over those that dont!

It also follows that by avoiding known brakes on growth you will continue your progress uninteruppted. These brakes include drugs, fags, clubs, fleshy bits of other humans, alcohol, stupid diets etc etc.

Hard to avoid I know, especially at twenty - but there you go!

One last thing - the cheapest and most useful supplement anyone can buy (in my opinion) is vitamin C. Its safe, cheap, very useful, easy to take, not unpleasant to swallow and easily stored. If I were you I would take it by the bucketloadful.

Hope this helps!

[jtwigg]

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fleshy bits of other humans

I was under the impression that higher levels of test correlated with higher levels of sexual activity in a bi-directional relationship.
(haven't read the studies myself, but chaosandpain.blogspotdotcom mentions it frequently. I'll have to have a look at them when I get time later this week.)

[Wotan]

You're right it does. And this does tends to thwart the world conquest, sword-flailing stuff wearing nothing but a loincloth a la Arnie.

This is where the discipline comes into it. Unfortunately mine ran out fairly quickly.

In my twenties I used to cry out, "Begone demons and take thy tempations with you, for I am destinied to rule the world and have no need of thy miserable lures".

This worked for about two weeks - and then my hormones met Denny and I had to sell the loincloth etc so we could go to the pictures.

This explains why I do not rule the world. I think. Youth is cruel.

[Timmm]

Thanks for that wotan, i'm the least 20-year old like person you'll ever meet.
Have never touched alchohol, go to bed around 8.30 and have good training plan, no Monday= bench Tuesday=bench etc

I did suffer an eating disorder, as readers of my log will know, and although i'm 30kg heavier than I was just over a year ago I did wonder whether I may have underlying hormonal problems as a result.
Thank you for your responses, and trust me that I am making full use of my favourable age, and of all of the informaton that I have accrues through reading (probably far too many) research studies and articles

[profi]

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My question is whether the potential cortisol release during/after the session is driving adaptation, or whether cortisol should always be kept as low as possible (i've been in a 'gaining' phase for around 14 months, and still need much more).

No, cortisol should not always be kept as low as possible. If you had too little cortisol in your blood you would suffer from panic attacks at any little problem in your life. I read once in a Dutch paper (my Dutch is not great) that lab rats genetically modified to have little or no cortisol in their blood suffered from panic attacks more than their normal counterparts. On the other hand excessive training can raise cortisol. If you feel too edgy just spread your load of workout in a longer time or reduce your load.

[Wotan]

Yes. The fact is, of course, that cortisol is there for a reason. Coping with stress is one of them. The problem lies with chronically elevated cortisol levels - to which the answer is a change of lifestyle, or priorities, or general outlook on life. Not getting rid of something that's doing its best to keep you alive!

[Timmm]

Yes, I did of course not that cortisol was vital, the wording of my question didnt make it clear, but I meant whether cortisol should always be kept low in that post workout period, or whether it was serving a function in the adaptation process.