Pre Exhaust - Good or Bad

[Richard]

I've found my joints are doing much better lifting heavy & doing less. Just a case of what works for you though.

[Tom]

agreed, u can shift heavy weights with low rest periods... try 5x5 with 60second rest, its hard work

[hailtotheking]

Muscle exhaustion techniques, such as pre- and post- exhaustion, supersets, tri sets, drop sets, etc. i think can have their uses. It is strongly believed that an effective way to trigger muscle growth is to cycle between short mesocycles of accumulation and intensification microcycles (i.e a few weeks).

Accumulation microcycles are typically high volume, and can involve using special exhaustive techniques to temporarily place the body in an over-reaching / over-training state. The muscluar system takes a hammering, but the CNS is left relatively unscathed

Intensification microcycles are also called 'realisation blocks', where the volume is dropped significantly, and the intensity (i.e loads) are significantly increased). Now the CNS takes a hammering, and the muscular system can recover and supercompensate somewhat.

Basically, the way it works is you train with exhaustive high volume for a few weeks on an accumulation microcycle, then you switch to an intensification microcycle for a few weeks and your body (esp. the muscles) will 'supercompensate' in retaliation to the hammering it previously took, and decent growth as well as strength gains should occur.

This way of cycling training periods, as well as the supercompensation phenomena, has been observed for many years in Eastern Bloc athletes and coaches.

[MartinM]

Agree with everything in your post Hail except the 'pre-exhaust' reference. Intensities techniques such as drop sets etc can actually be good as you have outlined but only in the short term. Pre-exhaust doesnt qualify for this however.

Simon - I would try increasing either the volume or density of your workouts. Simply decreasing rest periods is a good way of adding density. Other options are obivously increasing sets OR reps.

[kp1512]

It does work, can work and is a good tool to use in the arsenal when it comes to building muscle

I used this for around 18 months, in periods using the BFT training (Beyond Failure Training) protocol. Thats what training methods was extremely intense, it can lead to over training.

A very good example of ths Pre-Ex, is to get on teh Pec Dec (YES Pec-Dec) and do a triple drop or a single to exhaustion....and then get on to your main chest mass builder (imemdiately or after 60 secs) and do your working set..........try it and youll see......

Alot of the times, many ppl goddam overanalyse everything in this game!...Give it a go....observe for 4-6 weeks...and see how it works...noone can say it doesnt work...and if they do...there eitehr stupid or just not very bright in opening there mind to the fact we are all different and we all have a hybrid makeup of muscle fibres in different parts of out bodies

KP

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I'd like views on pre exhaust.

I'm using it more as I get older as I can't lift as heavy as I once did due to injuries and being an old fart.

I know that Martin and Meat don't seem to rate it, but it makes sence to me: you isolate the muscle and work to failure, then use a compound exercise to wring every last drop from the muscle tissue.

It's knackering, but does mean that you've not sold youself short intensity wise.

Any thoughts, or experience of possitive/negtatives of this approach would be welcome.

[Resurrected]

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Intensities techniques such as drop sets etc can actually be good as you have outlined but only in the short term. Pre-exhaust doesnt qualify for this however.

Why? And do not quote me research. Quote me real life examples that prove that pre-exhaust does not work.

[James Copping]

Its not that it doesnt work. Its just not optimal.

[Resurrected]

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Its not that it doesnt work. Its just not optimal.

And within your answer lies the problem with many replies on these forums! The question did not ask is this an optimal way to work out. But people jump on there high horse stating no this is rubbish, you should do this rather than that!

Its all about balance. I am not a great fan of pre-exhaust. I have used it (many years ago) and yes it had its place in my training, It may still in the future.

But to say

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I've never used it but have always liked the idea of it....... until I realised it was pointless

is wrong. How can you know it is pointless? You have said you have never used i!

It may be pointless for MartinM but it does not mean it has no place in anothers training. the vast majority of people are not always training optimally!

[simon m]

Oh dear, I'm agreeing with 43 again...repeat 1000 times don't agree with the old git

43 is right that my original post was to discuss the merits and I've found pre exhaust more useful as I've got older due to injuries etc

Hail's post & kp1512's were interesting and seem to confirm my findings.

I has also reduce rest time between sets and my workouts take no longer than 35 minutes, so intensity/density wise I'm with Martin.

From experience, it seems that the older one gets, the less weight you can bang around due to injuries etc., so drop sets, pre exhaust and other intensity raising methods come more into play.

From May, I will be posting a journal as I will be the first anniversary of my return to training and in this I will sue different methods which are perhaps more suitable for us ahem, more mature trainers.

Peace!

[TwoGun]

Pre-exhaust is useful to throw in now and again if you find that your workout is starting to grow a bit stale. It's one of those things like rest-pause and partials. used in moderation I find, from personal experience, they are a useful way of breaking through plateaus.