Ultimate Diet 2.0, by Lyle McDonald

**cinch** · 22-03-2008 11:53 AM

Just wondering if anybody has read Ultimate Diet 2.0, by Lyle McDonald? Tried the diet or knows much about it?
From what Ive heard it comprises of low carb/ low cal days with high rep work and highcarb/ high cal days with low rep work. 4 full body workouts per week.

**Gareth83** · 08-05-2009 07:44 PM

I have been doing this for the last 8 weeks (6 weeks diet followed by 2 week maintenance) and here are my thoughts;

Firstly I feel it is another (but complicated and well thought out) way of manipulating calories over a weekly cycle by getting you to exercise more but eating less yet keeping protein consistent to reduce muscle loss.

I don't feel the carb load is required for fat loss but due to the rest of the week's diet and programme you can 'get away' with such huge amount of carbs. It is however a good method to break the diet up to ensure adherance.

The diet isn't the most healthful IMO. It is a low fat approach and the carb load annoys me, as to get in the amount of carbs prescribed you need to consume substantial amounts of glucose and refined foods. Bagels seem to be a favorite!

Now I think anyone can get lean following a more traditional diet and training programme but the results speak for themselves. I got down to around 10% last year quicker than what I have on this programme despite following it to the letter.

Despite my criticisms I am willing to continue the diet as it is only for another 6 weeks for me then I will revert back to my paleo/IF way of eating.

The plus side to this diet is everything is laid out for you in stone so there's no margin for error if you follow it correctly and don't interpret how you would 'like it to be'.

Any other users have experience with this diet?

**motokouk** · 09-05-2009 10:19 AM

Wow, I never thought you'd follow the plan, given your IF and paleo lifestyle. I've have the book, great read. I wouldn't try it myself as I think the refeed is just too much. I pride myself on eating clean 95% of the time so to go and gorge on junk would be a bit contradictory! You can get some good ideas from the book though, there's plenty of science behind everything.

Gareth, could you outline a typical day of diet including the IF pattern? I'm still intrigued by both paleo and IF.

**vincee** · 09-05-2009 12:24 PM

i've read the book, but never tried it. carbloading is essential so you dont fall in to catabolic state. my friend who's tried it, says that deplation training on low carbs is a killer

lyle doesn't recomend it for someone who already isnt lean. its much easier to get to low BF on common low carb, calorie restriction diet.

Quote

The plus side to this diet is everything is laid out for you in stone so there's no margin for error if you follow it correctly and don't interpret how you would 'like it to be'.

true, and there's useful forum where you can get advice directly from lyle

**James Copping** · 09-05-2009 12:31 PM

Its pointless for someone over 15% bodyfat, more traditional methods will work just as well.

For someone looking to achieve <10% bodyfat it is excellent. I have done it multiple times a few years ago with great results.

**motokouk** · 09-05-2009 12:35 PM

Quote

Originally Posted by vincee

i've read the book, but never tried it. carbloading is essential so you dont fall in to catabolic state. my friend who's tried it, says that deplation training on low carbs is a killer

lyle doesn't recomend it for someone who already isnt lean. its much easier to get to low BF on common low carb, calorie restriction diet.

true, and there's useful forum where you can get advice directly from lyle

No no no..You missed my point! I understand the whole point of the carb load, I utilize a refeed myself in my carb cycling diet. But I wouldn't want to have to carb load on junk food! That was my point, I like to eat real, whole foods..Eating junk would go against the whole health aspect of this lifestyle.

**Gareth83** · 09-05-2009 02:21 PM

That is why I'm against it. Lyle comments on his forum that the fact you are lean means you are healthy, it is overweight that leads to disease (I disagree take lean smokers for example!!)

He's against paleo diets, organic foods and in fact all matter of what most of us would describe as healthful foods. He dislikes Gary Taubes (yet has never read his book), tends to be against large amounts of saturated fats

But he gets people lean!

**motokouk** · 09-05-2009 02:57 PM

Quote

Originally Posted by Gareth83

That is why I'm against it. Lyle comments on his forum that the fact you are lean means you are healthy, it is overweight that leads to disease (I disagree take lean smokers for example!!)

He's against paleo diets, organic foods and in fact all matter of what most of us would describe as healthful foods. He dislikes Gary Taubes (yet has never read his book), tends to be against large amounts of saturated fats

But he gets people lean!

So what protocol do you follow..You look to the pro's like lyle but there's so many conflicting opinions. What I did like with lyle's book that he explained the process of mobilizing fat, so you could apply that knowledge to your own diet and training...I dunno. It's hard to know what to follow. When I read these ebooks some are against full fat dairy, others aren't. What's the problem with full fat dairy? Apart from the fact it's saturated fat.

How have you progressed on the diet/routine then? Got a before and current photo?

**Gareth83** · 09-05-2009 03:04 PM

What do you mean what protocol do I follow?

I am following UD2.0

There is no problem with full fat dairy, but it's calorie/fat dense so wouldn't really fit in with UD2.0

Progress seems to be going well, although I made similar if not better progress last year doing my own thing.

No photo's, I just use the mirror and my own opinion these days

**motokouk** · 09-05-2009 03:15 PM

Quote

Originally Posted by Gareth83

What do you mean what protocol do I follow?

I am following UD2.0

There is no problem with full fat dairy, but it's calorie/fat dense so wouldn't really fit in with UD2.0

Progress seems to be going well, although I made similar if not better progress last year doing my own thing.

No photo's, I just use the mirror and my own opinion these days

Sorry that was a hypothetical question, based on confusing, contradictory advice given out by pro's. I like Tom Venuto's book and the g-flux idea from berardi, but they still go by the low fat dairy..I just ignore that part.

Gareth, bit off topic but I would like to bulk using low carb and high carb methods, low on off days and high on w/o days combined with intervals and steady state on off days. Do you think this will work out, how have you bulked in the past? I've gotten myself pretty lean and want to keep on top of that really, but slowly add some mass.