When to switch to another program. (Wendler's 5/3/1)

[JDC]

I'm personally not in the position to be switching to anything, this is just pure curiosity. Read over Wendler's 5/3/1 a few times and have noted plenty of people singing it's praises (including beginners, interestingly enough.)

My question is would those with experience place it in a particular point in the 'ladder' of programs? I mean for example, on Stronglifts (not that it's gospel or anything) the ladder of strength Medhi promotes is to work through 5x5, then Madcow, then SL Advanced.

Again, I'm not at that stage yet of even moving to Madcow but I'm just curious because I can't seem to find an answer online about this. Where would you place it? Is it ok for anyone, or is it a more useful program for advanced lifters?

[SpiderDan]

5/3/1 can be started at any time.

Wendler also bought out a beginners version and full body version (which im doing)

With 5/3/1 the progress is a lot slower than the standard 5x5 programs as you only add 2.5kg to upperbody and 5kg to lower body lifts a month.

Beginners generally can add weight to the bar faster than that.

The difference is though that 5/3/1 takes into consideration the ups and downs of life. Sometimes you feel awesome and sometimes you dont, the program allows you to advance despite that.

[fctilidie]

^^ Spot on

Only thing I'll add is that I started 531 as a beginner around the same time as two of my mates started stronglifts, there progress was slightly faster at the start but they soon stalled and I've carried on making steady progress the whole time while they've been switching programs trying to get things moving again. 2 years later and my lifts are quite far ahead of theres at a lower bodyweight, maybe I've got better genetics or whatever but I read a lot of forums and see a lot of people on stronglifts seem to get to a certain level and then stall and then struggle to get going again. I'm sure there are plenty of success stories but in my view steady gains over a long period of time is the better option.

[JDC]

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^^ Spot on

Only thing I'll add is that I started 531 as a beginner around the same time as two of my mates started stronglifts, there progress was slightly faster at the start but they soon stalled and I've carried on making steady progress the whole time while they've been switching programs trying to get things moving again. 2 years later and my lifts are quite far ahead of theres at a lower bodyweight, maybe I've got better genetics or whatever but I read a lot of forums and see a lot of people on stronglifts seem to get to a certain level and then stall and then struggle to get going again. I'm sure there are plenty of success stories but in my view steady gains over a long period of time is the better option.

Interesting. Will keep that in mind.

[Mart001]

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^^ Spot on

Only thing I'll add is that I started 531 as a beginner around the same time as two of my mates started stronglifts, there progress was slightly faster at the start but they soon stalled and I've carried on making steady progress the whole time while they've been switching programs trying to get things moving again. 2 years later and my lifts are quite far ahead of theres at a lower bodyweight, maybe I've got better genetics or whatever but I read a lot of forums and see a lot of people on stronglifts seem to get to a certain level and then stall and then struggle to get going again. I'm sure there are plenty of success stories but in my view steady gains over a long period of time is the better option.

Becuase it carries to much volume for a novice LP, if you look at starting strength or the strength villan LP's they work in a 3x5. Change strong lifts to 3x5 and what have you got... Medhi is an unoriginal program *******iser and a marketing prick...

[JDC]

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Becuase it carries to much volume for a novice LP, if you look at starting strength or the strength villan LP's they work in a 3x5. Change strong lifts to 3x5 and what have you got... Medhi is an unoriginal program *******iser and a marketing prick...

Doesn't mean you can't take what's useful from his work. Even if it's mostly adapted/stolen.

It's like saying a motivational speaker is just stating the obvious and is stealing money from the hopeless for their seminars etc. Might be true but there is always something to take from the content.

[Mart001]

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Doesn't mean you can't take what's useful from his work. Even if it's mostly adapted/stolen.

It's like saying a motivational speaker is just stating the obvious and is stealing money from the hopeless for their seminars etc. Might be true but there is always something to take from the content.

True he has marketed well and its led many on a good path.

but...

...the motivational speaker has taken (stolen? can you steal a linear progression methodology?) a product and made some adaptions to the product but hasnt taken into account that those adaptions may have a negative impact on the product. Is he linked to starting strength and wendlers... no but he says he is, he does get commission through his link from amazon... the guys come back shortchanged from what initially was a good starting point for many... but then he can deadlift 200kg with ABZ... he must be cool

I just dont like the sneaky ****... its a sales pitch, compare his site to 70's big and info Lascack puts out, starting strength forums where Mark answers question after question and wendlers as well, and the strength villian guy very high quality places... when you go to stronglifts it poses as a site full of help to begginer laymen but turns into an infomercial... and really I dont want to contemplate even having a poke in the guys gold magic circle.. ****!

[JDC]

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True he has marketed well and its led many on a good path.

but...

...the motivational speaker has taken (stolen? can you steal a linear progression methodology?) a product and made some adaptions to the product but hasnt taken into account that those adaptions may have a negative impact on the product. Is he linked to starting strength and wendlers... no but he says he is, he does get commission through his link from amazon... the guys come back shortchanged from what initially was a good starting point for many... but then he can deadlift 200kg with ABZ... he must be cool

I just dont like the sneaky ****... its a sales pitch, compare his site to 70's big and info Lascack puts out, starting strength forums where Mark answers question after question and wendlers as well, and the strength villian guy very high quality places... when you go to stronglifts it poses as a site full of help to begginer laymen but turns into an infomercial... and really I dont want to cotemplate even having a poke in the guys gold magic circle.. ****!

I totally agree with all that. Just pointing out, it's not like you can't take the 5x5 program he promotes, pay nothing, put some hard work in, see progress and never visit the site again.

[fctilidie]

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Becuase it carries to much volume for a novice LP, if you look at starting strength or the strength villan LP's they work in a 3x5. Change strong lifts to 3x5 and what have you got... Medhi is an unoriginal program *******iser and a marketing prick...

Exactly what I would of added if there weren't so many Medhi disciples on this site

[Mart001]

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I totally agree with all that. Just pointing out, it's not like you can't take the 5x5 program he promotes, pay nothing, put some hard work in, see progress and never visit the site again.

Or you could take his program change it to a 3x5 routine right from the start so you don’t get bogged down in to much volume thus:

Do not on each workout perform with bad form on the 4th and 5th sets due to fatigue
Do not stall early in the long game, if when you stall you then move to 3x5 anyway well then your be behind in wieght then if you started with 3x5
get to work with heavier weight
get to jump in bigger steps
fill much better about yourself

hey that 3x5 looks like (sctaches head…)…

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Exactly what I would of added if there weren't so many Medhi disciples on this site

ah i dont think there are any "medhi disciples" people can see through his BS, just a stronger opinion for stronglifts as thats what was picked up first by a majority who post regular.