HGH and recovering from muscle injuries (using L-Glutamine)

[Wotan]

Quote

Why is this not made law already!

Stand at the next election pal, you'd get my vote. Ha ha ha!!!!

[NeilD]

Been using this protocol for 3 weeks now so just about to start my week off.. I didn't notice any 'GH gut' but have absolutely had great improvements in digestive function, seems to have helped with some problems with various types of food I have. Also seem to have general improvements in mood. One thing I noticed which may not be related is my skin seems to be a bit greasier at the beginning of the protocol (maybe losing some of the crap in there?).

I know your stance on using synthetic GH compared to the bodies own production which frankly makes sense, but whats your thought on the use of the peptides (i.e. GHRP's) which influence the bodies own pulses of GH?

[Wotan]

I'm glad its working for you Neil.

Personally speaking I am happy with the way things I do them. But everyone is different, and really the only way to find out is try them for yourself. Having said this there is a right way and a wrong way to do even this.

If you want to compare two different products, protocols, procedures etc you must, absolutely must, keep a diary about them. If whatever you are doing lends itself to measurements of some sort then fine - do it. Often though you will find that things are a bit more subjective than that. This is still good though, the observation about oily skin is a good example of something that might have gone forgotten but would be worth writing down.

The other thing is to make sure that you give each trial a fair enough length of time. Personally I've always stuck to six weeks - no clue as to where I got that idea from, though the notion that by that time most of the bodies cells would have renewed themselves seems to ring a bell.

So, the thing to do is not take what I say as Gospel but try it out for yourself.

[NeilD]

Yeah I can certainly see the sense in that, I'm going to take a better approach to the next cycle using your protocol and keep a good set of diary notes to help. The only problem I see with the peptides is they are injectable, also relatively new - they DO sound good, but same with anything thats sourced like that your not sure of the quality of the peptide.

So better off using the protocol you suggest all in all lol, again thanks for making this research and advice available.

[sendos]

I wonder if using l-arginine in this protocol would be of any use? I know they use it in a clinical setting in stead of the insulin stress test to assess GH production disorders.

[Wotan]

Yes, there are studies that have used it. It was the secretogue first used by Pearson and Shaw in one of the seminal Life Extension works of the 1980's, Practical Scientific Life Extension .

From initially using arginine most people progressed to ornithine though because you only needed half the dose and there were less viral problems. In the end virtually everyone started using glutamine at the same dose as arginine. It was cheaper, safer and (gram for gram) more effective. It also had other benefits (such as helping with IBS).

The only reason it fell out of favour, to be honest, was the hype and glamour surrounding actual GH injections following the Rudman Study. A lot of doctors in America made a lot of money injecting GH despite the FDA granting it a license for use in dwarfism only.

China got in on the act and started making their own stuff and selling it to the West. The quality was apparantly dubious though. The FDA have now banned it (I think - or will be doing so fairly shortly) so everyone will be back to glutamine breakfast drinks I should think.

[Fred]

wow, this is a really informative thread!

I have one question. Can I take this first thing with a 200mg caffeine tab?

I either run or gym 5 times a week in the mornings and am in a fat loss phase. The runs are fasted but I will have an oat and whey shake on gym days about half an hour after getting up, which is also about half an hour before the gym.

[Wotan]

Uhmm, a caffeine tab eh?? To be honest I've never tried that. I presume its to aid fat loss?

The only way to tweak the basic regime into a personalised one is to try out each modification one at a time and keep the diary, really. Sure, its time consuming etc but after a year you will be an expert on exactly how your body reacts and what results to expect.

Instead of the caffeine tab have you tried just using green tea, maybe with a slash of lemon juice in it (but no sugar)?

You will still get a "perk" from it but its also got the fluid you need first thing in the morning, its got anti-oxidants, its somewhat thermogenic and being hot will easily dissolve the glutamine. A decent-sized mug will also hold enough tea to get it all out of the stomach (a normal tea-cup maybe not).

Its definitely worth trying I'd say.

[Fred]

Hi Wotan, thanks for the long response. The caffeine is to aid fat loss, and perhaps I should have wprded the question better. Is there any physiological reason not to take the caffeine and l-glutamine together? With plenty of water of course.

I haven't tried the tea option quite simply because the caffeine tab is more potent at 200mg and gives me a morning kick up the a**e.

[PaulB]

Excellent thread with really good info.
Can I ask:
Is 2 heaped MP small scoops (about 9g) in a pint of water first thing in the morning and 5g last thing at night overkill?

Also, if I leave the glass to stand for a while the LG settles on the bottom, is this normal or am I using a different LG to what your talking about.

Based on this thread I will be doing 3 weeks on 1 week off.




Thanks